Off-topic Contest

by donsjokes Thu Jan 26, 2012 5:04 pm

Here's the scenario: You've been betting on horse races for years, but you've recently hit a losing streak. You borrowed a rather large sum of money to cover what you thought was a "sure thing," but your horse loses. The "businessman" you borrowed the money from is actually a front-man for the Mob. Now, you're in some serious trouble! Without the ability to pay your debt, they catch you walking down the street. They blindfold you and throw you into a van where you unfortunately get knocked unconscious. When you awake, the blindfold is gone. You're sitting in a room with only one light suspended above a table that has one chair - in which you are seated. On the table there is a note. It reads, "You messed up, but it's good for you that I'm a gambling man, too. Look around. You'll find 2 doors that are guarded by 2 associates of mine. Behind one of the doors, you'll find a stairway to the street above. Behind the other is another associate well-versed in the fine art of torture and death. You can go through either door at any time AFTER you ask one of the guards any question you want. Very simple, right? You ask a question, you walk through a door. It doesn't get any easier than that. But wait, here's the catch: you can only ask ONE question, and you can only ask that question of ONE guard. Now let's see if your luck changes. Oh yeah, there's just one more thing - one of the guards always lies, the other always tells the truth. Good luck!"

Here's the contest: The first person that can post a question that can be asked of a guard that can lead you to freedom wins 25 FSP. The question must be specific, and it has to be a question that you can ask either the liar or the truth-teller and still yields the same answer.

Hint: There are only 2 known questions that can solve this problem. Either question will get you 25 FSP. Find another question that fits the same parameters, and I'll throw in another 10 FSP!

by Shadowsc Thu Jan 26, 2012 5:33 pm

Ask either guard, "Will the other guard say that your door leads to safety?" Go with the opposite of whatever is said.

by donsjokes Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:01 pm

Shadowsc wrote:Ask either guard, "Will the other guard say that your door leads to safety?" Go with the opposite of whatever is said.

In this scenario, let's make the liar guard the death door. His answer will be "yes." The other guard would really say "no," but we're asking the liar.

Ok, now let's ask the truth-teller that's guarding the freedom door. His answer will be "no." The truth-teller's door actually does lead to freedom and the liar knows that. So he lies.

Conclusion: The liar answers "yes," and the truth-teller answers "no." You still don't know which door leads to what.

by Shadowscub Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:35 pm

Crap, I think I worded it wrong. Two doors, one left, one right. Ask one of the guards if the other would say that the right door leads to safety. Then pick the opposite door of what he said.

by donsjokes Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:46 pm

Congratulations, Shadowscub! That works! You get the 25 FSP prize! jocolor

by Shadowscub Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:47 pm

Say the right door really leads to death. The liar knows the truth-teller would say no, so he lies and says yes. The truth-teller knows the liar would lie and say yes, so he says yes as well.

by Shadowscub Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:48 pm

Yay! I knew I was close....remember vaguely from Labyrinth, lol

by **Hitch** Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:16 pm

Yay Shady, congrats! Smart girl!!! Very Happy

Nice quiz, Don. Is there more?

by **KingHomer** Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:54 am

Can you not ask the same question three more ways? ask about the other door, ask if the right door leads to death, ask if the left door leads to death.

Can't think of an original question though, is there another question not based on that theme?

by donsjokes Thu Feb 02, 2012 4:34 am

KingHomer wrote:Can you not ask the same question three more ways? ask about the other door, ask if the right door leads to death, ask if the left door leads to death.

Can't think of an original question though, is there another question not based on that theme?

Here are the only 2 possibilities: "Which door would the other guard tell me leads to safety?" and "Which door would the other guard tell me leads to death?" Notice that the only difference between these 2 is the nature of the door in question. The door, itself, is irrelevant. What you are doing is playing against the guards' weaknesses. Let's look at it mathematically. What you are given in this scenario is something like a+b=c. By using associative properties, we know that c-a=b and c-b=a. So let's assign values to these. c=door to death, a=guard, and b=question. the reason I'm using door to death for c is because you have to choose the opposite door for what you're asking for, in this case which leads to freedom.

c (death door) = a (liar) + b (which door will the other guard say leads to freedom?)
the liar is going to say that the truth-teller will tell you the death door leads to freedom. choose the opposite.
c (death door) = a (truth-teller) + b (which door will the other guard say leads to freedom?)
the truth-teller is going to say that the liar will tell you the death door leads to freedom. choose the opposite.

The reasons this works is because you're not asking about either door specifically and you're eliminating the truth/lie variables.

Ok, let's put the other 3 you mentioned to the test. Asking about "the other door" is the same as dealing with either the left or right doors, which are specific doors. So, let's put "the other door" on hold for now.

Let's assign the left door freedom and the right door death.

Left door:
Ask the liar "Does the left door lead to freedom?" Answer "No."
Ask the truth-teller "Does the left door lead to freedom?" Answer "Yes."

Right door:
Ask the liar "Does the right door lead to freedom?" Answer "Yes."
Ask the truth-teller "Does the right door lead to freedom?" Answer "No."

You get conflicting answers. Even if you assign each guard to a door and ask about the other guard's door, you still get conflicting answers:

Truth-teller gets the freedom door, Liar gets the death door.
"Does the other guard's door lead to freedom?"
Truth-teller - "No."
Liar - "No."

Since we don't know which one lies or tells the truth:
Truth-teller gets the death door, Liar gets the freedom door.
"Does the other guard's door lead to freedom?"
Truth-teller - "Yes."
Liar - "Yes."

Both doors can't lead to freedom, nor can they both lead to death.

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